Afridi's real match-winning role (Osman Samiuddin)

[Sledger]

Afridi's real match-winning role
Osman Samiuddin

In hindsight, Shahid Afridi's first international innings has come to hang around him like a curse. It has condemned him forever after to expectations of a repeat, which is why his Kanpur hundred against India was probably the greater feat. But until recently it had thrown him into a kind of purgatory, stuck between the promise of that Afridi and the possibility of a milder Afridi of greater maturity and sense.

It's a shame, for only over the last few years has the truth about Afridi emerged, the truth he has propagated ever louder since he finally settled into the ODI side in 2004 and the truth he has actually known since he began: he is a bowler. He is not a batting all-rounder who bowls. With imagination, he could be a bowling all-rounder who can bat, though with that we could all be Brad Pitt or Angeline Jolie. Mostly he is just a bowler. Very occasionally he changes the game with a bat.

Not many people buy it still. At every press conference he has appeared in during the World Cup, he's been asked at least once when we can expect some, to use the unimaginative phrase, boom boom. What about your batting? Are you worried about your batting? When will you perform with the bat?

A few years ago he'd bother to give a proper response, to say he was working on it; the coaches and seniors were helping him; he didn't know why but he just felt like belting the ball as soon as he saw the bowler run in and so on. These last couple of weeks he has simply become dismissive, even a little snarky: "Yes, inshallah I will perform," "Yes, I am batting well," or "it was a good ball," which he said about a wide full toss outside off he scythed straight to point. Off a Canadian bowler.

He hasn't stopped caring about his batting altogether because he lives off the image, of course, as does the new sports equipment firm in Pakistan, Boom Boom. The idea of an Afridi six remains commercially lucrative but you can see it annoys him. He wants to be known as a bowler first. And as three games have reaffirmed in this World Cup, he is actually an out and out strike bowler and currently, Pakistan's most effective.

Statsguru, as it does so often, might shock you. Since the beginning of 2008, nobody has taken more wickets for Pakistan than Afridi, who has 94 in 66 ODIs. More impressively, only three bowlers around the world have taken more wickets than him in that time. Only Shakib Al Hasan has bowled more overs than him. And both his strike rate and economy rates for the top wicket-takers in that period, are among the best.

From every angle, Afridi is a striker, a matchwinning bowler and a golden one at that. It is to him Pakistan go for wickets and breakthroughs, for controlling the run-rate, for applying pressure. And he does it across that spread of the game - the middle overs - where matters are most difficult: runs need to be stopped to control proceedings and wickets need to be taken to win them.

On his best days, Afridi gets a quite vicious drift. It isn't a floating one like more traditional leg-spinners might get. It is rapid, an extension of his personality. Suddenly in flight the ball dips and swerves in, generally towards the front pad. When that happens, you know they're coming out of his hand well. In conditions such as he has met in Sri Lanka - "ideal," he says - where the ball might grip and skid and turn, he can even get a decent, loopy leggie going. The dismissal of Thilan Samaraweera at the Premadasa could not have looked better had it come in whites, with a red ball.

Nobody is sure quite how many variations he does possess probably not even himself, but there are enough. On those good days, if he gets a wicket early, he is trouble for the best sides; Associates like Kenya and Canada have little hope. He is all over you, in spirit the fast bowler his ethnicity almost demands him to be. On these days, he'll follow through further than most fast bowlers.

Against Canada he even brought back his legendary faster ball and one, clocked at 80mph, was quicker than anything Canada bowled all day. He once got Greg Blewett with one in the Australia tri-series of 1997-98 that hit the stumps before Blewett had even thought about bringing his bat down. And there was once the bouncer to Brian Lara, followed by an air kiss.

Most relevantly, bowling is how Afridi leads best. There is still a basic defensiveness in strategy and tactic and orthodoxy in field settings, but with ball in hand or in the field, nobody makes more of their presence than him. Not to disrespect Inzamam-ul-Haq's captaincy, which had fine points to it, but how the Canada chase could have drifted under his own leadership in the field? Afridi just doesn't let a game go, even if he fumbles and slips and errs, he is very much there. Pakistan responds to that kind of visibility and energy.

This tournament is driving him, you can see that as clear as day. He wouldn't mind some help - and he will need it - if Pakistan are to go further. He has taken just under half of all wickets taken by the side in three games: 14 of 29. Others have bowled well but he has always looked the likeliest wicket-taker. That would be, we can now conclude, because he is.

[Strike!]

Excellent writing as usual.

[Blitz]

Agreed. If he bowled like that since '96, we would have won A LOT more matches, and maybe his batting could have been better without all that pressure of hitting a 100 of 30 balls every match

Relying on his batting, and never bowling him full time has cost us SO SO many matches.

He only started bowling after Inzi retired. Before that, he was like Tendulker or Dilshan, 2-3 overs a match.

Another massive waste of talent.

[Afridi_Fan]

Acxellent Ji, Acxellent.

A bowler who can whack a few with the bat. Thats what Afridi is.

Once again, just for the heck of it.

Ji Oye Lala.

Di Oye Lala.

[NO 1 AFRIDI FAN]

A good read. This is what most people dont understand, they expext him to come in every game and get quick runs to change the game in our favour.

But please try to understand that he is a BOWLING ALLROUNDER!

[No_Username]

Originally Posted by Sledger This tournament is driving him, you can see that as clear as day. He wouldn't mind some help - and he will need it - if Pakistan are to go further. He has taken just under half of all wickets taken by the side in three games: 14 of 29. Others have bowled well but he has always looked the likeliest wicket-taker. That would be, we can now conclude, because he is.

Actually 15 of 29 , becasue of that run out.

[cricketindiafan]

94 wickets in 66 matches looks exciting, but look closer into those numbers.

During these 3 years, Afridi as a bowler does not average under 30 against any team other than the Aussies.

Aus - 11 match, 17 wickets@26.58 at a ER of 4.22
Eng- 5 matches, 4 wickets@57.25 with a ER of 5.25
India- 6 matches, 8 wickets@38 with a ER of 5.12
NZ- 10 matches, 10 wickets@36.9 with a ER of 4.53
SA- 5 matches, 6 wicets@43 with a ER of 5.16
SL- 11 matches, 12 wickets@39.16 with a ER of 4.87
WI- 4 matches, 4 wickets@44.25 with a ER of 4.72

52 matchs, 61 wickets@37 at a ER of 4.76 and a SR of 46.6 (a wicket every 7.4 overs) against top 8 sides, quite good but not good enough IMO if the last 3 years are looked at. Has had a great start to the WC though and looks to be the most potent bowler of the WC.

By way of comparison, Jhonson has 103 wickets in 67 matches, Broad has 100 wickets in 55 matches and Kulasekra has 92 wickets in 66 maches at around the same average and ER. Not sure if the three of them are rated highly as ODI bowlers.

Ready for the brickbats now

[Vegitto1]

Originally Posted by cricketindiafan 94 wickets in 66 matches looks exciting, but look closer into those numbers. During these 3 years, Afridi as a bowler does not average under 30 against any team other than the Aussies. Aus - 11 match, 17 wickets@26.58 at a ER of 4.22 Eng- 5 matches, 4 wickets@57.25 with a ER of 5.25 India- 6 matches, 8 wickets@38 with a ER of 5.12 NZ- 10 matches, 10 wickets@36.9 with a ER of 4.53 SA- 5 matches, 6 wicets@43 with a ER of 5.16 SL- 11 matches, 12 wickets@39.16 with a ER of 4.87 WI- 4 matches, 4 wickets@44.25 with a ER of 4.72 52 matchs, 61 wickets@37 at a ER of 4.76 and a SR of 46.6 (a wicket every 7.4 overs) against top 8 sides, quite good but not good enough IMO if the last 3 years are looked at. Has had a great start to the WC though and looks to be the most potent bowler of the WC. By way of comparison, Jhonson has 103 wickets in 67 matches, Broad has 100 wickets in 55 matches and Kulasekra has 92 wickets in 66 maches at around the same average and ER. Not sure if the three of them are rated highly as ODI bowlers. Ready for the brickbats now

In ODIs, economy rate is more important then the average.

[James]

Originally Posted by Vegitto1 In ODIs, economy rate is more important then the average.

best way of reducing overall run-rate over the course of the innings is to take wickets, and end the innings as quickly as possible, and for as low a score as possible. this means a better strike-rate, and a lower average for the bowler. personal economy comes second to wicket-taking ability.

Broad has a high-ish economy of 5.2 but is a top-class ODI bowler as shown by his average and strike rate.

[Vegitto1]

Originally Posted by Whippy best way of reducing overall run-rate over the course of the innings is to take wickets, which means a better strike-rate, and a lower average for the bowler. personal economy comes second to wicket-taking ability. Broad has a high-ish economy of 5.2 but is a top-class ODI bowler as shown by his average and strike rate.

It is not a fair comparison to compare a fast bowler to a spinner.

A fast bowler bowls at the start, with the new ball and at the end of an innings when the other team is going for everything.

Therefore a fast bowler has more opportunities to pick cheap wickets.

A spinner comes during the middle overs when teams (if they are not chasing a mammoth total) try to take things easy, milk the bowling rather then go for the big shots. Therefore, A spinners job is to mainly keep the run-rate low.

In ODIs, you win if you score more than the other team.

think about this now.

Broad comes on during the 45th over of an innings. the other team is 240/3

would you rather have Board concede 30 runs and get two wickets? (average of 15) or take no wickets and concede 10?

[James]

Originally Posted by Vegitto1 Broad comes on during the 45th over of an innings. the other team is 240/3 would you rather have Board concede 30 runs and get two wickets? (average of 15) or take no wickets and concede 10?

he doesn't concede three times as many runs as any other ODI bowler, so that's a ridiculous situation to try and suggest.

I would rather have him take 1-15 than 0-12 in three overs at the end of the innings, because the bowler at the other end would surely keep it tighter than usual (as the result of the wicket falling).

anyway, what do you make of strike rate and wickets per game, if economy is 'so' much more important than average? because Broad excels in these areas too...

[GOAT]

Originally Posted by cricketindiafan 94 wickets in 66 matches looks exciting, but look closer into those numbers. During these 3 years, Afridi as a bowler does not average under 30 against any team other than the Aussies. Aus - 11 match, 17 wickets@26.58 at a ER of 4.22 Eng- 5 matches, 4 wickets@57.25 with a ER of 5.25 India- 6 matches, 8 wickets@38 with a ER of 5.12 NZ- 10 matches, 10 wickets@36.9 with a ER of 4.53 SA- 5 matches, 6 wicets@43 with a ER of 5.16 SL- 11 matches, 12 wickets@39.16 with a ER of 4.87 WI- 4 matches, 4 wickets@44.25 with a ER of 4.72 52 matchs, 61 wickets@37 at a ER of 4.76 and a SR of 46.6 (a wicket every 7.4 overs) against top 8 sides, quite good but not good enough IMO if the last 3 years are looked at. Has had a great start to the WC though and looks to be the most potent bowler of the WC. By way of comparison, Jhonson has 103 wickets in 67 matches, Broad has 100 wickets in 55 matches and Kulasekra has 92 wickets in 66 maches at around the same average and ER. Not sure if the three of them are rated highly as ODI bowlers. Ready for the brickbats now

I had a feeling his average would be relatively high, not terrible for a spinner but still. Better comparison would be to see how he rates up with other spinners (Shakib, Swann, Bhajji and em) imo. I think Shakib might have more wickets then all of them but thats thanks to playing against Zimbabwe and co.

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by cricketindiafan 94 wickets in 66 matches looks exciting, but look closer into those numbers. During these 3 years, Afridi as a bowler does not average under 30 against any team other than the Aussies. Aus - 11 match, 17 wickets@26.58 at a ER of 4.22 Eng- 5 matches, 4 wickets@57.25 with a ER of 5.25 India- 6 matches, 8 wickets@38 with a ER of 5.12 NZ- 10 matches, 10 wickets@36.9 with a ER of 4.53 SA- 5 matches, 6 wicets@43 with a ER of 5.16 SL- 11 matches, 12 wickets@39.16 with a ER of 4.87 WI- 4 matches, 4 wickets@44.25 with a ER of 4.72 52 matchs, 61 wickets@37 at a ER of 4.76 and a SR of 46.6 (a wicket every 7.4 overs) against top 8 sides, quite good but not good enough IMO if the last 3 years are looked at. Has had a great start to the WC though and looks to be the most potent bowler of the WC. By way of comparison, Jhonson has 103 wickets in 67 matches, Broad has 100 wickets in 55 matches and Kulasekra has 92 wickets in 66 maches at around the same average and ER. Not sure if the three of them are rated highly as ODI bowlers. Ready for the brickbats now

16 wickets at 16.81 against Bangladesh has past your mind.

In 2008 he averaged 26.48
In 2009 he averaged 29.88
In 2010 he averaged 45.05
So far in 2011 he averages 15.16

So he had one below par year but even then his average(over 3 years) is not too bad.

Not sure why a spinner is being compared to quicks? Anyway you don't need stats to tell you Afridi is in hot form and far more dangerous than Johnson, Broad and co.

[Afridi_Fan]

You are right cricketindiafan, Afridi is crap. Now sleep well.

[cricketindiafan]

Originally Posted by Afridi_Fan You are right cricketindiafan, Afridi is crap. Now sleep well.

He isn't crap. All I am pointing to is, he has been inconsitent against top sides. His bowling against Sri Lanka in the WC was top class and that spell perhaps changed the game for Pakistan. Will be interesting to see if he sustains that form against other top sides as well.

[ali2220]

Originally Posted by cricketindiafan He isn't crap. All I am pointing to is, he has been inconsitent against top sides. His bowling against Sri Lanka in the WC was top class and that spell perhaps changed the game for Pakistan. Will be interesting to see if he sustains that form against other top sides as well.

He most probably will, and i can safely say that right now he's the best spinner in this very WC.

His past performance with the ball wasn't great and i never rated him highly, but he is doing a great job right now.

[Afridi_Fan]

I am sick and tired of posters who keep on trying to downplay the achievements of Pakistani players, so really I will simply agree with you so that you can have a good time. Have a good time.

[cricketindiafan]

Originally Posted by Afridi_Fan I am sick and tired of posters who keep on trying to downplay the achievements of Pakistani players, so really I will simply agree with you so that you can have a good time. Have a good time.

I am the last one to do that. Credit where its due "Has had a great start to the WC though and looks to be the most potent bowler of the WC." "His bowling against Sri Lanka in the WC was top class and that spell perhaps changed the game for Pakistan", but that does not change those numbers.

Great start to the WC no doubt, inconsistent against top sides in the last 3 years again a fact.

[No_Username]

I think its a bit harsh Afridi_Fan , atleast he is backing it up with evidence rather than those typical Afridi haters who do nothing else but shout , so he shouold be respected for that. He isn't one of those "typical " afridi Haters. And he has made a sensible point I think

[Afridi_Fan]

Okay fine. If Afridi's five wickets haul can save our faces against teams like Canada then I'll take those five wickets haul every day of a week and thrice on sunday.

[No_Username]

Originally Posted by Afridi_Fan Okay fine. If Afridi's five wickets haul can save our faces against teams like Canada then I'll take those five wickets haul every day of a week and thrice on sunday.

kyon? sunday ko sale pe hoti hain?

[cricketindiafan]

Originally Posted by Afridi_Fan Okay fine. If Afridi's five wickets haul can save our faces against teams like Canada then I'll take those five wickets haul every day of a week and thrice on sunday.

Gussa thook do saahab.

[saamry]

Afridi is an enigma.

For all of his fans and haters. Enjoy while is on the field that he brings something no other player brings that once all said and done, we will all miss him.

[Saad Hasan]

A usually idiotic rambling from Osman-ramiz-is-a-better-test-opner-then-shoaib-mohammad-jiay-bhutto-Samiuddin...

Pathetic excuse for Afridi's batting failures...if it was lack of ability then one could excuse Afridi but one cannot excuse an utter disregard to minimum level of professionalism, which is exactly the reason that Afridi's batting has lacked over the years...even the worst kind of tailenders or specialist bowler make an attempt to show some semblance of temper...it is always their lack of ability more then anything else that betrays them...Afridi's no care attitude has more or less been his achilles in batting and there is not excusing that...

Furthermore, if Afridi has always been a bowler, then I am afraid he should have never played international cricket cause not until 2005/2006 was he able to improve his bowling to the level that he could make the team on the bowling department alone...

[Abdullah Zubair]

Originally Posted by Saad Hasan A usually idiotic rambling from Osman-ramiz-is-a-better-test-opner-then-shoaib-mohammad-jiay-bhutto-Samiuddin... Pathetic excuse for Afridi's batting failures...if it was lack of ability then one could excuse Afridi but one cannot excuse an utter disregard to minimum level of professionalism, which is exactly the reason that Afridi's batting has lacked over the years...even the worst kind of tailenders or specialist bowler make an attempt to show some semblance of temper...it is always their lack of ability more then anything else that betrays them...Afridi's no care attitude has more or less been his achilles in batting and there is not excusing that... Furthermore, if Afridi has always been a bowler, then I am afraid he should have never played international cricket cause not until 2005/2006 was he able to improve his bowling to the level that he could make the team on the bowling department alone...

Yaar , Allah ne saath diya , aagaya wo team me..ab usko criticize karna chodo aur dekho ke wo kaisa world cup layega, Inshallah.

[James]

not comparing him directly to quicks, just questioning why economy takes precedence over other statistics. all the best ODI bowlers have a superb average and strike-rate, economy whether good or passable takes a back seat.

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by Whippy not comparing him directly to quicks, just questioning why economy takes precedence over other statistics. all the best ODI bowlers have a superb average and strike-rate, economy whether good or passable takes a back seat.

In LOI's it's very important to keep the runs down. You have to remember a lot of teams like to play out Afridi without taking risks, a bit like they do against Swann. The pressure Afridi creates usuallly ends up helping the bowler from the other end. Sometimes the weaker bowlers tend to get the wickets. Yuvraj Singh picked up 5 against Ireland and anyone who hasn't seen the wickets could easily assume his bowling was unplayable when in reality the Irish got out to bad balls which should have been punished.

[James]

Originally Posted by KingKhanWC In LOI's it's very important to keep the runs down. You have to remember a lot of teams like to play out Afridi without taking risks, a bit like they do against Swann. The pressure Afridi creates usuallly ends up helping the bowler from the other end. Sometimes the weaker bowlers tend to get the wickets. Yuvraj Singh picked up 5 against Ireland and anyone who hasn't seen the wickets could easily assume his bowling was unplayable when in reality the Irish got out to bad balls which should have been punished.

wickets are wickets and the best bowlers get the most of them in the end.

economy rate - how does this differ, really? from 4.2 to 5.2 amongst good ODI bowlers? 1 bloody run an over? up to 10 runs an innings, possibly as little as 5 if someone doesn't bowl full quota?

getting more wickets more often (wickets per game and strike rate) at 5-10 runs less per wicket than the next bloke - this is a very good tradeoff if you concede 1 run an over more than him...

economy is a nice supplement in ODIs, but the best ODI bowlers with the strongest averages and strike rates usually come out with a good economy anyway, either directly or indirectly because of their ability to take wickets.

In ODIs, strike rate leads to average leads to economy.

IMO.

[KingKhanWC]

Originally Posted by Whippy wickets are wickets and the best bowlers get the most of them in the end. economy rate - how does this differ, really? from 4.2 to 5.2 amongst good ODI bowlers? 1 bloody run an over? up to 10 runs an innings, possibly as little as 5 if someone doesn't bowl full quota? getting more wickets more often (wickets per game and strike rate) at 5-10 runs less per wicket than the next bloke - a very good tradeoff if you concede 1 run an over more than him...

Bowlers who have a low economy rate also put pressure on especially if the opposition is chasing. A maiden over can change the game as it could push up the run rate a fair bit. Obviously wickets are important and Afridi's wickets with his economy rate over the last 3 years is very good.

Stats are stats and never tell the whole story, cricket is far too complicated, it's not the 100M sprint.

imo batsmen in this world cup will be more worried about facing Afridi than facing people like Broad, Johnson, Harbajhan.

[zulfiqar]

Originally Posted by Whippy wickets are wickets and the best bowlers get the most of them in the end. economy rate - how does this differ, really? from 4.2 to 5.2 amongst good ODI bowlers? 1 bloody run an over? up to 10 runs an innings, possibly as little as 5 if someone doesn't bowl full quota? getting more wickets more often (wickets per game and strike rate) at 5-10 runs less per wicket than the next bloke - this is a very good tradeoff if you concede 1 run an over more than him... economy is a nice supplement in ODIs, but the best ODI bowlers with the strongest averages and strike rates usually come out with a good economy anyway, either directly or indirectly because of their ability to take wickets. In ODIs, strike rate leads to average leads to economy. IMO.

Fully agree. E/R is the last statistic I would look at in ODI's (and of course tests). In T20's its a fair bit more important but in ODI's, average is the most important factor I think (and S/R or wickets/match).

Afridi has never been an exceptional bowler like the OP is suggesting.. he's had moments of brilliance and overall has been carted all around the park by other teams throughout most of his career. It was some time after Inzi when Afridi really matured into a good bowler (remember Bangalore?).

But to suggest Afridi should have always been looked on as a primary bowler is just misinformed and WRONG. He would be out of the team within a few matches, let alone a few series. He was in the team because of his all-round abilitiy, and more so his pinch hitting. Yes, the first-inning-hundred was a curse for him because of our expectations of him, but he was never nearly as good as say, Razzak.

Regardless, why are we bashing Afridi for what he hasn't accomplished? Point is, he is our main strike-bowler and has been for 3+yrs, and he is off to a WICKED dream start in the WC! VIVA LALA!!

[Cosmic]

Afridi Is A Pure Batsman Who Didn,t Use His Brain like Imran....If He had used it Pakistan Has So Many ODI victory Still The Best Among 2000s era Player.and the last star power pakistan has....

[hasanmehmoodkhan]

afridi is a hot and cold bowler, sometimes he is amazing sometimes he is average. thankfully for Pakistan he is bowling splendidly in the world cup.

[James]

whole Broad thing shouldn't be read too much into. just picked him out as the first example that popped into my head of a bowler with econ of 5 who still excels in all areas of ODI bowling of course, the Beast seems to have racked up similar stats to the top ODI bowlers of late and deserves great credit

[Usman]

Originally Posted by Whippy whole Broad thing shouldn't be read too much into. just picked him out as the first example that popped into my head of a bowler with econ of 5 who still excels in all areas of ODI bowling of course, the Beast seems to have racked up similar stats to the top ODI bowlers of late and deserves great credit

I don't think Broad excels in all areas of ODI bowling. Just look at the game against Ireland for a lesson in how not to bowl. When under pressure, expect Broad to serve a mouthwatering selection of four balls. Personally, I am always bemused as to how Broad has managed to survive at the international level. You look at his pitch map and 95% of the time, he bowls all over the place. And yet, he is one of those bowlers who consistently gets wickets off poor bowling, day after day, match after match. Occasionally, and I mean occasionally, he bowls well, eg in the last match against SA. Usually, there's nothing potent about his bowling and he is far outclassed by Anderson. Yet Broad still has a decent-ish record. Quite strange. I think it may have to do with the fact that if you keep bowling badly, eventually a batsman will give away his wicket in trying to wack the ball to the boundary!

[Real.Badshah]

Most accurate discription of Afridi to date:

Start watching from 032 ??? (three minutes fourty two seconds)



Naam: Shahid Afridi
Jins: Pathaan!
Umer: Us kay maamu ke betay ka naam hai......jo laapata hai

[James]

Originally Posted by Usman I don't think Broad excels in all areas of ODI bowling. Just look at the game against Ireland for a lesson in how not to bowl. When under pressure, expect Broad to serve a mouthwatering selection of four balls. Personally, I am always bemused as to how Broad has managed to survive at the international level. You look at his pitch map and 95% of the time, he bowls all over the place. And yet, he is one of those bowlers who consistently gets wickets off poor bowling, day after day, match after match. Occasionally, and I mean occasionally, he bowls well, eg in the last match against SA. Usually, there's nothing potent about his bowling and he is far outclassed by Anderson. Yet Broad still has a decent-ish record. Quite strange. I think it may have to do with the fact that if you keep bowling badly, eventually a batsman will give away his wicket in trying to wack the ball to the boundary!

before the Ireland game, Broad had been laid up in his bed for days with food poisoning. the journalists close to the team described how Broad had been literally dragged out of bed to play against Ireland because England wanted to win and impose themselves on the tournament. of course, anyone who has ever had food poisoning (including me) will tell you that food poisoning wipes you out for a few days to a week, and can cause severe weight loss, because you don't even dare drink water at times, let alone eat. after my bout of food poisoning, I was barely able to go and do a short shift at work on Saturday, after the poisoning had hit on the Monday. You don't only need to starve the bug, you need to rebuild and recover by eating food, replenishing fluids and taking vitamins. So it's hardly a surprise that a fast bowler at the very highest level failed after he had surely not recovered from food poisoning.

so Broad missed the game v India, bowled well v Holland on a flat pitch (2-fer, was only denied 3-fer by an encroaching fielder), was a sick-note against Ireland and shouldn't have been played (and is thus excused), and was world-class v South Africa. 4-15 in 6 overs. wow. also took 10 wickets in 2 games in the warm-ups. terrific limited overs bowler, who clearly has put paid to the 'England bowlers can't bowl in the subcontinent' myth over the last month or so.

Anyway, your post suggests to me that you haven't watched enough of Broad in ODIs. what you said here would be very true about Stuart Broad the bowler in tests. in the whites, he generally relies on economy and the batsman's mistake (went at 2.8 an over in the Ashes) to take wickets, and rarely bowls an attacking enough line to take a hatful (and when he tries, he often strays onto leg-stump). so yes, definitely a disappointment on the whole in the test match arena thus far.

however, Stuart Broad the bowler in ODIs is a very different animal. he is a much more positive bowler in ODIs. he is either given a slip and a gully and bowls an off-stump line, or given a circle and told to bowl directly at the stumps. these would hardly be attacking tactics in tests, far from it, but in ODIs, these plan will get you wickets if you bowl well, which he usually does.

he doesn't have a decent-ish record in ODIs, he has a very, very, very fine record. A far better record than the much-vaunted Steyn and Anderson just to name two. Having watched ODI cricket for the last couple of years, and looking at his record in comparison to others, a better comparison would be Broad the ODI bowler and Morkel the ODI bowler, or even Gul the ODI bowler - Broad, Gul and Morkel all have similar and excellent records.

Broad's spell against South Africa was simply wonderful, didn't see a single four ball myself. Full, straight, four massive wickets, match won. If he does that once every 3 games then he's worth his place.

[Down2Earth]

"it was a good ball," which he said about a wide full toss outside off he scythed straight to point. Off a Canadian bowler.

[md_tariq]

Osman missed out a few things. If Afridi had played as a bowling all rounder, he would have lost his place long time back. His bowling was very average or poor against top teams during 2008 or 2009. He still kept his place due to his once in a while beasty or boom boom innings and jsut because he was considered as a batting allrounder. He never used to complete his full quota of overs during 2008/09/early 2010 times against top teams. It was not captain's fault giving him lesser number of overs, if you had seen the bowling analysis of those matches where he did not complete his quota, he was gone for over 6 or 7 runs per over.

[Fireworks11]

Saw him at Lord's practicing his batting for just 10 minutes in the nets before a T20 game. He kept swinging at every ball, not a single elegant drive/block lol.

He really worked hard on fielding and bowling though, spent some solid time on that.

That's just the way he is. No nonsense with the bat.

[Sledger]

^ Are you talking about the final?.. lol.

[Fireworks11]

Originally Posted by Sledger ^ Are you talking about the final?.. lol.

No. It was the group game against Sri Lanka which Pak lost. It was exciting even in the nets.

Afridi went for a golden duck in the match lol.

[Saqs]

at the 'it was a good ball' comment.

Originally Posted by cricketindiafan During these 3 years, Afridi as a bowler does not average under 30 against any team other than the Aussies.

Wait, so when it comes to Laxman performing against Australia - it is known as "performing against the best in the business" - but that somehow doesn't tickle your fancy for Shahid?

Give it up.

6000+ runs. 300+ wickets.

2nd player in history of the game to achieve the feat.

When your Yuvi/Yusuf/Irfan brigade even get close to that achievement, then please do come back and feed me the humble pie.

[md_tariq]

Originally Posted by Saqib Salman at the 'it was a good ball' comment. Wait, so when it comes to Laxman performing against Australia - it is known as "performing against the best in the business" - but that somehow doesn't tickle your fancy for Shahid? Give it up. 6000+ runs. 300+ wickets. 2nd player in history of the game to achieve the feat. When your Yuvi/Yusuf/Irfan brigade even get close to that achievement, then please do come back and feed me the humble pie.

You dont understand one thing. Laxman is outstanding against Aussies, but he has good average against most of the remaining teams, thats why Laxman is one of the very very special players. As far as Afridi break down stats in the last 3 yrs are concerned, against australia he has reasonable stats nothing extraordinary but decent, whereas with almost all other top teams his average is poor or below average. thats what cricketindiafan is talking about.

[Saqs]

Originally Posted by md_tariq You dont understand one thing. Laxman is outstanding against Aussies, but he has good average against most of the remaining teams, thats why Laxman is one of the very very special players. As far as Afridi break down stats in the last 3 yrs are concerned, against australia he has reasonable stats nothing extraordinary but decent, whereas with almost all other top teams his average is poor or below average. thats what cricketindiafan is talking about.

Laxman is not "very very special" (lame) against other teams. His average is quite average - which has been the reason he hasn't consolidated and cemented his spot in the team.

I'm a big fan of VVS but really it's as clear as day that he only performs to his optimum against Australia.

And he is crowned for that. Not sure why that same criteria does not apply for Shahid.

[Afridi_Fan]

And the discussion carries on. He is such an adorable man with nice silky hair, hard to ignore. Isn't he?

[*sallu*]

Agree with the cricinfo article

Should always have been a bowled

Would have had a great(er) career then

[zulfiqar]

People saying he should have always been a bowler first seem to forget afridi was nothing special with the ball when he first arrived. This could be due to the pressure of him opening (& being compared) with Saeed Anwar but he still had plenty of overs with the ball to prove his worth, and he never did.

And yes, you could argue that a player wasn't being utilized properly but come on, think about it. He'd been in pak cricket for FAR TOO LONG to make an excuse like that, which is the same thing I have to say about Abdul Razzaq. You can't just DEMAND any position in the team when you don't have the performances to back it up!

Anyway, I've always liked both of these players although with Afridi it's been more of a love-hate thing until finally when he matured a bit once Inzi came along and he started performing in test matches (not sure why he's not playing tests right now). We've got to back our team and it's just a matter of time Razzaq fires too. He's batting too low in the order and we all know that, so let's hope he makes some noise with the ball (). Hafeez/Shehzad will join the party soon. I just pray they all get some good experience in the remaining 3 groups games so we are over-flowing with confidence come QF!!

[MRSN]

But don't under estimate his batting ability in big games.He can really change the course of match with the bat.He is mentally becoming very stronger.

[the Great Khan]

Indians are the best..Pathan and kumar are better than afridi..let me get stats vut vut I must prove ve are the besht or I will sarafy inside..

P.s no one likes the smell of a burning Indian in the morning!!

[ShehryarK]

Originally Posted by Saad Hasan A usually idiotic rambling from Osman-ramiz-is-a-better-test-opner-then-shoaib-mohammad-jiay-bhutto-Samiuddin... Pathetic excuse for Afridi's batting failures...if it was lack of ability then one could excuse Afridi but one cannot excuse an utter disregard to minimum level of professionalism, which is exactly the reason that Afridi's batting has lacked over the years...even the worst kind of tailenders or specialist bowler make an attempt to show some semblance of temper...it is always their lack of ability more then anything else that betrays them...Afridi's no care attitude has more or less been his achilles in batting and there is not excusing that... Furthermore, if Afridi has always been a bowler, then I am afraid he should have never played international cricket cause not until 2005/2006 was he able to improve his bowling to the level that he could make the team on the bowling department alone...

I respect you a LOT bhai, but I must disagree with your post here.

Its not Afridi's fault that he was selected before 2005/06. He didn't bribe people. He didn't have PPP Ministers supporting him publicly and in press. He didn't have bookies making connections with officials on his behalf. He was just doing his own thing, in his own time, on his own dime.

All Pak selection committees, captains, coaches, Cricket Boards etc felt he should have been in the team - so he was. Maybe he shouldn't have been given so many chances, maybe it was one chance or even 10 chances too many way back in 2001... But who cares? We are in 2011 now! Let's leave all that for the historians.

Today, in 2011, he's not only our best player, he's also our Captain.

And as Pakistani supporters, if we cannot get behind the Captain of Pakistan in the middle of a World Cup, then what kind of Pakistani supporters are we? What is the point and the purpose of this "support" then?

There are plenty of "friendly neighbours" and others criticising Afridi and thus the Pak team just for the sake of it, or simply out of jealously - let's not join them, please!

And yes, make no mistake about the bit I have highlighted in bold - criticisms of Afridi today are not because people find his fans annoying. Even I find childish 'fan-boyism' of ALL kinds very immature and unedifying, whether its for Afridi or YK or Yousuf.

But this is not what criticism of Afridi today is, a lament at his "fanboys". Critics of Afridi today are using that as a pretext to subtly lambast and criticise the Pak team, whether they know it or not; because Afridi embodies the spirit of this team and exemplifies its attitude.

True Pakistani supporters and patriots such as you need to rise above that, Inshallah. IMHO, of course.

Originally Posted by Abdullah Zubair Yaar , Allah ne saath diya , aagaya wo team me..ab usko criticize karna chodo aur dekho ke wo kaisa world cup layega, Inshallah.

My thoughts exactly.

[Badsha]

I disagree with this article. Shahid Afridi is most definitely not a bowler.

This is a bit of a knee-jerk reaction and I'll be ready to bump this thread when he starts scoring.