Yasir Arafat - Unluckiest guy to ever play for Pakistan?

[Gujar]

In my opinion Yasir Arafat should be one of the first names on the team sheet in all formats of the game but the selectors and management (Captains, coaches etc.) have ruined one of our best and most complete players. He took 9 wickets in an innings just a few weeks back yet we pick weird windmills like Sohail Tanvir ahead of him. A truly disgusting state of affairs.

[*sallu*]

Definitely one of the unluckiest since I've been following cricket, don't know about the rest

[Sledger]

Not good enough for international cricket. He's lucky to have kept getting selected for Pakistan when he just isn't up to the mark imo.

[Omar Malik]

He has been one of the unluckiest in the lot really as he's never been given a consistent run in the team be that in Tests, LOI's or T20's - He's always had the 1 or 2 games here and there and in that space its quite hard to judge a player and a guy who had only played 10-15 games since he debuted some good 8-10 years ago (I've also mentioned this in a previous thread, so cant exactly remember the amount of games he's played since he came to the international team).

Now just with a handful of games, how can he perform with ease and make his mark and prove that he can cut it out at international level, and to some extent in 2007 when he was given his test cap he did show some promise with 7 wickets and 40 odd score on which was pretty much a flat deck with bowlers struggling ofcourse.

Yasir, just like Azhar Ali and Asad Shafiq, needs to be given a run in a series consistently to see how he responds to it and not throw him out after 1 or 2 bad games to see if he has what it takes to survive on the international level.

[pakistanbest]

Originally Posted by Omar Malik He has been one of the unluckiest in the lot really as he's never been given a consistent run in the team be that in Tests, LOI's or T20's - He's always had the 1 or 2 games here and there and in that space its quite hard to judge a player and a guy who had only played 10-15 games since he debuted some good 8-10 years ago (I've also mentioned this in a previous thread, so cant exactly remember the amount of games he's played since he came to the international team). Now just with a handful of games, how can he perform with ease and make his mark and prove that he can cut it out at international level, and to some extent in 2007 when he was given his test cap he did show some promise with 7 wickets and 40 odd score on which was pretty much a flat deck with bowlers struggling ofcourse. Yasir, just like Azhar Ali and Asad Shafiq, needs to be given a run in a series consistently to see how he responds to it and not throw him out after 1 or 2 bad games to see if he has what it takes to survive on the international level.

Agree with every word, would have taken Yasir over for the WC, it is injustice to the hardwork and determination Yasir has shown, really sorry sight

[Justcrazy]

Rana or Yasir are much better than than sohail tanvir. Sohail tanveer is not a world beater.
Yasir has loads of wickets in domestic matches and deserved a chance. Its gross unfair.

[Acim]

Yasir never really performed apart from his debut test. He looks world class at FC levels only. When there is competition for places player has to perform almost everytime when given a chance. Yasir has not been able to do that.

[*sallu*]

He has played 3 test matches ffs, all 3 on pancakes

Hes batted thrice on those pancake, and has a 50 and a 40.
So he justified his batting on those pancakes.

You can't judge his bowling, or anyones bowling on those pancakes.
Yet, despite that, he took 7 wickets in a test on a tour where India handled Akhtar, Sami and Tanvir with ease.

So how can you say he hasn't performed apart from his debut when he has played only 3 tests, where bowlers much "better" than him failed worse than him and he averaged 47 with the bat?

[Desire]

he has fitness issues, same as tanveer ahmed. both are good but get tired after few overs.

[*sallu*]

Yasir Arafat is injury prone, yes, but his fitness is outstanding LOL

How can you say he gets tired when he is widely acknowledged as one of the best, if not the best county death bowler

[Acim]

Originally Posted by *sallu* He has played 3 test matches ffs, all 3 on pancakes Hes batted thrice on those pancake, and has a 50 and a 40. So he justified his batting on those pancakes. You can't judge his bowling, or anyones bowling on those pancakes. Yet, despite that, he took 7 wickets in a test on a tour where India handled Akhtar, Sami and Tanvir with ease. So how can you say he hasn't performed apart from his debut when he has played only 3 tests, where bowlers much "better" than him failed worse than him and he averaged 47 with the bat?

Against India when conditions were helpful in the first session he took wickets and after that he was cannon fodder. If you say that his bowling can't be judged on flat tracks then you can't give him credit for batting well on flat tracks either.

It's interesting how you only bring up the matches where he has done reasonably well and sucked otherwise.

Remember the T20s and ODIs he has played in and failed?

[*sallu*]

Yes, I remember the last time he played for Pakistan, in the 2 t20s against England.

I suggest you go have a look at the scorecards and come back to me.

Conditions were barely helpful in the first session as well lol in that game against India.
They were slightly better, but nothing compared to the conditions in which our recent fast bowlers have debuted.

Arafat, Rao, Talha and Sohail Khan got very rough deals.
I'm not saying they are good, but they were mishandled, all of them, you don't select a fast bowler for a pancake pitch where anything less than 75 is considered as missing out for a batsman and then drop them.
I doubt there was any innings less than 350 in any of their games

Arafat given 3 games, the rest 1 each, all on pancakes.

And the batting, I was just using as an example, that he performed with the bat when conditions suited him, which shows he is not a domestic bully

[Acim]

Originally Posted by *sallu* Yes, I remember the last time he played for Pakistan, in the 2 t20s against England. I suggest you go have a look at the scorecards and come back to me. Conditions were barely helpful in the first session as well lol in that game against India. They were slightly better, but nothing compared to the conditions in which our recent fast bowlers have debuted. Arafat, Rao, Talha and Sohail Khan got very rough deals. I'm not saying they are good, but they were mishandled, all of them, you don't select a fast bowler for a pancake pitch where anything less than 75 is considered as missing out for a batsman and then drop them. I doubt there was any innings less than 350 in any of their games Arafat given 3 games, the rest 1 each, all on pancakes. And the batting, I was just using as an example, that he performed with the bat when conditions suited him, which shows he is not a domestic bully

But the thing is Aamir and Asif did well in conditions when they weren't so helpful for the bowlers either unlike Arafat, they didn't only do well in helpful conditions.

I can't access cricinfo, would you be kind enough to present his match by match stats, since you seem to give them so much importance.

We are talking about arfat here forget about the other, our selectors are not saints and have been known to made horrendous selections.

Araft is not an out and out bowler he is what we call bits and pieces cricketer for int. level, might be an AR at the FC level.

Who would you have in the team for?

[Acim]

Yasir Arafat in ODIs:- 4 wickets in 11 matches average of 93 economy of 5.4.

Yasir Arafat in Tests:- 9 wickets at an average of 48.66 and an economy of 4.19.

Since he is so good according to you and have only been given chances on flat tracks, he should have atleast been able to keep the runs down if he wasn't picking up wickets.

Economy of 4.19 thats Sami like.

Need I say more.

Abhee tu T20 record nahee mil raha bhai ka mujhay.

[*sallu*]

LOL, I have never mentioned, nor will I ever mention that Yasir Arafat is even half as good as Amir or Asif, I don't know where you got that idea from

Also, I didn't say Arafat has done exceptionally well in tests, just gave him a special mention for his debut performance.

Which bowler averaged less than 50 on those flat tracks we played against Sri Lanka or India among the quickies?

As for his ODI perormance, how many consecutive ODIs has he played?
Can you judge a player by selecting him for 1 game, then recalling him after 2 years, then selecting him for 1 game.

I am merely judging him by the signs of promise he has shown, because theres no point looking at his career stats as they are simply too small and spread over too many years

(i) Showed promise in debut test with 7 wickets
(ii) Has a 40+ and 50+ score in 3 test innings
(iii) His last 2 t20 performance against England were outstanding
(iv) His county, list A, twenty20, first class performances have been by far the most outstanding in Pakistan's recent cricketing history.

So, the question remains, based on all the above, did he deserve more chances? YES !!!

My issue is not with Arafat being a international success/failure, my issue is for him to be given a chance to prove which one of the above it is.
You would be crazy to suggest that he has gotten the chances that his first class achievements have deserved

You would be crazy to say that Arafat should play ahead of Akhtar, Asif or Amir (even though they are bowlers and he is an all rounder) but surely, when these guys are unavailable so often, selectors should be looking at someone with experience and performance rather than always selecting 2-3 rookies

[IM NOT YOU]

my two cents:

1) agree with OP in the sense that he was never given an extended run. unfortunately, this fundamental flaw in pakistani cricket selection has still not been addressed. not only do we not give players a FULL series to prove themselves (often dropping an inexperienced player after only 2 or 3 of the 5 ODI's), we also select the wrong player for the wrong format. so yes, yasir has suffered because of this, but a countless number of other pakistani cricketers have as well

2) from the opportunities he was given (in terms of bowling), i do not recall him showing enough for anybody to say that he has the 'it' factor. pakistani bowling standards are very high (from the past) and in order for a 'pace' bowler to be given a long run, he has to show that he has that 'it' factor/potential to be a world beater. often, if this is not the case, the player is dropped.


based on these two concepts (which aren't necessarily 'fair' but are the way things work with the pakistan selection system) , yasir wasn't exceptionally hard done. i would've liked to see him get a few more opportunities but at the same time, i just dont think he is up to par with international cricket. is it fair to make such a claim? probably not.

[Acim]

Originally Posted by *sallu* LOL, I have never mentioned, nor will I ever mention that Yasir Arafat is even half as good as Amir or Asif, I don't know where you got that idea from

Aince you referred to our bowlers doing well in England in helfupful conditions, which bowlers you think bowled there? Arafat and Rana Naveed?

Originally Posted by *sallu* Which bowler averaged less than 50 on those flat tracks we played against Sri Lanka or India among the quickies?

Since he is good he should have done better than the others atleast if not exceptionally, so he is crap like the others? As i sad he even struggled to keep the runs down.

Originally Posted by *sallu* As for his ODI perormance, how many consecutive ODIs has he played? Can you judge a player by selecting him for 1 game, then recalling him after 2 years, then selecting him for 1 game.

When there is competition for places thats how it works, kabhi tu aisee performance day daita kay selectors kay liye drop karna impossible ho jata, like Misbah did in the T20 WC.

Originally Posted by *sallu* I am merely judging him by the signs of promise he has shown, because theres no point looking at his career stats as they are simply too small and spread over too many years (i) Showed promise in debut test with 7 wickets (ii) Has a 40+ and 50+ score in 3 test innings (iii) His last 2 t20 performance against England were outstanding (iv) His county, list A, twenty20, first class performances have been by far the most outstanding in Pakistan's recent cricketing history. So, the question remains, based on all the above, did he deserve more chances? YES !!! My issue is not with Arafat being a international success/failure, my issue is for him to be given a chance to prove which one of the above it is. You would be crazy to suggest that he has gotten the chances that his first class achievements have deserved You would be crazy to say that Arafat should play ahead of Akhtar, Asif or Amir (even though they are bowlers and he is an all rounder) but surely, when these guys are unavailable so often, selectors should be looking at someone with experience and performance rather than always selecting 2-3 rookies

You see the signs of promise in the very little good performances he has given. I see more signs of no promise in alot more times he has failed.

Then again when there is competition for places, guys like Arafat have to perform almost every time given a chance. Since you say he is an all rounder whom would you play him in place of, Abdul Razzaq?

lol Rana Naveed has shown more signs of being a better batsman than him on int. level.

[*sallu*]

I won't answer long because I've said all I need to on Arafat

I've not even said the other were rubbish, if you notice earlier, I said Rao, Talha, Sohai Khan etc were all hard done by.
I'm not giving my opinion on cricketing ability alone, the majority is towards fairness in selection, where Yasir has suffered.
And despite this, he has done better than all other quickies who debuted on roads, he has a 5er and shown promise with the bat.

And as for Rana, I suggest you see Rana's early performances as well, he used to get a good solid phainty early on from India (Karachi match ring a bell?) but he was persisted with and he showed faith.

My only problem in this whole thing is, when you select someone, especially with a first class record such as Arafat's, give him a proper fair run, his first class performances deserve it !!!

[Acim]

He got what he deserved for not performing that is "The Way Out".

Rana's Karachi match, he had performed well on occasions before that and did well on occasions after that aswell and gave match winning performances and even series winning performances. India series (Ring a bell?)

Yasir arafat's oly good performance with the ball came on a pitch which had help for the bowlers and he was good enough to make use of it. And on the same pitch he was useless when there was no help.

The only players who get long runs in the team are the ones who are hugely talented and are performing on and of or the ones who have no replacements. Yasir has done nothing.

Yasir has only been brought in the team when there have been the Big Boys missing and he has done nothing to cement his place like Misbah did, so he is getting what he deserves.

There are many players who look world class at FC level but are mediocre at best at int. level, sorry to say Yasir has been one of those till now. World class at first class level only.

[saad1024]

Originally Posted by *sallu* Definitely one of the unluckiest since I've been following cricket, don't know about the rest

Come on yaar, ab itna bhi acha naheen hai woh...

[Sir john]

there are too many cricketers of his types

big example is bernard of west indies


i feel sad for all of them

[*sallu*]

Originally Posted by saad1024 Come on yaar, ab itna bhi acha naheen hai woh...

How many first class cricketers do you know with more than 700 wickets?

If you are aware of any playing the game, can you also tell me how many test matches they have played please?

[Inswinger]

He just wasn't given a consistent run. Also, he had the bad luck of getting injured when he was selected.

[SOSami]

Originally Posted by Sledger Not good enough for international cricket. He's lucky to have kept getting selected for Pakistan when he just isn't up to the mark imo.

I agree.

I hate to criticise a Ram but I don't think he was quite good enough either.